Poll: Do you read TOS before buying?

JamesLike. I like this thread. Made me think about what I actually need from TOS. Answer: predictability. Same terms tomorrow as today. No unilateral changes with 24-hour notice.

Some providers: "we may update TOS at any time, continued use constitutes acceptance." Evil.
Some: "we will notify 30 days before material changes, continued use constitutes acceptance." Less evil.
Some: "material changes require explicit re-acceptance." Good. Rare.

Hetzner: 30-day notice for material changes, but "continued use constitutes acceptance." Middle ground.
Greenhost: explicit re-acceptance required. Best. But they're small.

I would pay 20% more for explicit re-acceptance. No provider offers this as premium feature. Missed opportunity.

Brokensolid. I read TOS for solid state, not solid legal. Kidding. I read for hardware specs and replacement policies.

"bare metal" means what? New server? Refurbished? Consumer parts or enterprise? Some providers: "server grade." What does that mean? Xeon E3 is "server grade." It's also 10 years old.

Hetzner auction: explicit model, generation, known specs. No TOS fiction. What you see is what you get. https://www.hetzner.com/sb This is why auction works. Transparency beats terms.

Magicmahdi. I read TOS for mahdi reasons. Just kidding. I don't read. But this thread convinced me to check one thing: can I export my data?

My email provider: TOS says "you may download your data via standard protocols." IMAP is standard. Good.
My cloud storage: "export via web interface." 1GB at a time. I have 400GB. Bad.
My VPS provider: "you are responsible for your own backups." No export help. Neutral.

Data portability is my new TOS filter. Thanks thread.

Geniusdock17. I read TOS for container and orchestration terms. Can I run Kubernetes? Docker Swarm? "Container" mentioned anywhere?

Some providers: "no virtualization inside virtualization." No KVM in KVM. But containers aren't virtualization. Are they allowed? TOS silent.

I ran Docker on Contabo VPS for 3 years. No issue. But TOS never said yes. Never said no. Legal limbo is uncomfortable business foundation.

Creek27. I read TOS for 27 reasons. No, I don't read. But I bookmarked this thread for when I need to pretend I did.

Real talk: the people who need TOS protection most (non-technical users) read it least. The people who read it most (technical users) need it least, because we have workarounds. This is structural failure, not individual failure.

Regulation should require TOS summaries: "this contract in 100 words." Some EU moves toward this. Most of world doesn't. Until then, threads like this help. Thanks all.

MadeSuper3. I made super effort to read TOS once. AWS. 3 hours. Understood maybe 60%. Then they changed it. New version. 4 more hours. Understood maybe 65%.

The marginal cost of re-reading after update is almost as high as first read. And they update 2-3 times per year. This is not sustainable for individual consumers.

Olespete's spreadsheet is great but how often updated? Quarterly? For 47 providers? That's a job, not a hobby.

TOS literacy doesn't scale. We need structural solutions, not heroics.

Guruhere. I am guru here. I tell you: TOS is maya, illusion. The real contract is reputation. Hetzner has reputation. Contabo has reputation. OVHcloud has reputation. TOS is just words explaining reputation.

Bad reputation with good TOS: still bad. Good reputation with bad TOS: still good, mostly. Reputation changes slower than TOS. More reliable.

I check Webhostingtalk, LowEndBox, Reddit, Twitter. 6 months of history. Then I buy. TOS is reference after problem, not guide before.

Techwill. I will read TOS when providers will write it clearly. Until then, we have stalemate.

"Clearly" means: bullet points, not prose. Numbers, not "reasonable." Defined terms, not "as determined by us." Separate documents per product, not one monster doc.

Hetzner is closest. Still not great. Contabo improvement is real but from terrible to mediocre. OVHcloud is... OVHcloud.

The will exists on consumer side. The will does not exist on provider side. Because unclear TOS benefits provider. Obvious incentive problem.

Maxpant2006. I read TOS in 2006. Different internet. 400 words, clear, fair. Now? 12,000 words of "we may, we might, at our sole discretion, including but not limited to."

The inflation is measurable. I should track word count over time. Olespete's spreadsheet but historical. AWS TOS 2010 vs 2024. How many words added? How many rights subtracted?

Someone with archive.org skills should do this. Not me. I don't have skills. I have outrage.

Systemschoi. I read TOS for system integration. Can I use their API in my product? Resell their services? White-label? Affiliate?

Most TOS: "for personal use only." But I have LLC. Business use? Maybe. "Contact sales." I contact. "Enterprise plan starts at $500/month." I need one VPS. No.

The gap between consumer TOS and business needs is where many of us live. Solo developers, small agencies. Too big for personal, too small for enterprise. TOS doesn't acknowledge we exist.